A Jeri character analysis by JesuOtaku.
Wait, can we actually talk about Igor. Now I haven’t beaten Persona 2. In fact I’m at the very beginning, but I HAVE been to the Velvet room and he has all of those supernatural friends and shit in there with him and that’s cool and they all seem to answer to some other dude or some shit.
BUT in P3 he’s like “Fuck the police I’m the head nigga in charge I run this bitch with a fine ass assistant.” what did he DO? How did he come to power?
Did he summon Cthulhu or something? How?
I haven’t beaten Persona or either Persona 2 games, but I’m guessing that Philemon (basically the boss of supernatural thingies in the Personaverse) fought with Nyarlathotep at the end of the game and was weakened or something like that
Philemon is still in P3 and P4, he just takes the shape of a blue butterfly that observes the guests of the velvet room.
Now, Igor has probably the most important Velvet Room job: the creation of new Personas. While we don’t know what happened to the other denizens, Igor is still there doing the same thing he always has. Philemon is probably weakened, so he probably doesn’t have much communication with Igor anymore. So Igor has to fend for himself in the Velvet Room, which is probably why he has assistants.
From someone who has played 2-4 I agree with what Thomas said. Igor is simply Philemon’s middle man so to speak since Philemon is suppose to be a neutral deity. Philemon gives the power of persona (directly and indirectly) and Igor helps create persona and guides those who have persona. The events of Persona 2 did weaken Philemon greatly (that was his own damn fault tho) so he now is on the sidelines, helping persona users and granting persona indirectly. I could go on about how the persona games are connected with each other. But this is about Igor. 8`D
I laugh at those who think the Investigation Team is more powerful than SEES just because they don’t start off fighting Mayas
SEES defeated both Nyx and Erebus…
Oh my god…give me a break will you?
Firstly, Nyx wasn’t defeated and neither was Erebus. THEY WERE PUT AT BAY. They cannot be defeated as long as humanity wishes for them. This is the reason why Minato became the seal to begin with: TO PREVENT THEM FROM RETURNING. Did anyone pay attention to that? Although the Investigation team didn’t face Nyx nor Erebus, they DID defeat a goddess.
So technically, they are just as strong and equally matched. The only difference is that they faced different opponents.
My thoughts are that they’re essentially evenly matched, but the IT had a more difficult time with the Shadows - they were constantly fighting against the darkest parts of their own selves, and seeing their classmates and friends doing the same, becoming privy to their worst secrets, knowing that no matter what you do, they won’t forget that they saw this part of you, too. Sharing that experience with an unrelated entity - something you don’t even want to recognize in yourself, and you have to confront it with a near stranger seeing everything!
When it comes to “physical” strength… There’s not really a way to judge that, honestly. I believe that Souji has more Personae than Minato, but Minato is World, Death and Fool. The entire base of the games are different - self versus outside, confidante versus mirror, truth and clarity versus not being apathetic (I’m sorry about this last one, I’ve never finished Persona 3 so the end plot is a bit unclear to me). They are, essentially, in two completely different ‘universes’ - same world, yes, but so many different circumstances. It’s almost impossible to compare them to one another. The only way we could determine who was stronger between the two protagonists would be to pit them against each other, but even that is unreliable. The player is the one who makes the Protagonist how he is - you pick the Persona and skills to cultivate, the traits to nurture, the responses he has. You pick whether or not he will be Diligent and Kind and Understanding. This is all dependent on the player.
However, I do agree with the OP - if the reason people think that the IT is more powerful than SEES is just because they don’t start off fighting Mayas, then the person with that opinion is a fool. There are other reasons to feel more attached to one particular group rather than the other. The fact that they started off with different opponents is not one of them, and it should be remembered that SEES was fighting in drastically different circumstances than the IT was.
Personally? I love the IT. Persona 4 was my favorite, hands down, without fail. But this is mostly because I could identify more with the characters. I struggle with my own dark parts every day. I get personal. I love the duality of the characters, how they developed throughout the entire game - I love Naoto and Rise and Kanji and Yousuke and Teddie. I don’t like Yukiko, but that’s because I find her too difficult for me to relate to - her fears are silly, in my opinion, but I can respect that she leads a vastly different life than I do. I love the overall theme of Persona 4 - I love the music, the color scheme, the side quests and characters without name (Errand Boy and Spacey Girl), the family aspect, the friendship and acceptance. I love that I can go back and play through it, beat it again and still feel the love for it that I did the first time. I love the battle system and the shortcut and the part-time jobs.
But just because I love Persona 4 doesn’t mean I don’t like Persona 3. I have different opinions of the games. I don’t much like the battle system because I prefer to be in control of my party members, and when Yukari has a chance to heal me right before I would die, and would prefer to attack the Shadow with wind when it reflects wind (even though I have her on Health), I resent that, and have to start all over again. I dislike the impersonal feel of Minato’s relationships with others - very few of them feel genuine to me. I would express concern over my friend with the hurt knee before I would agree not to tell anyone - firstly, it’s dangerous! - and it bothers me on a very deep level that Minato seems to be saying only what his friends want to hear, and not what they need to hear.
What we need to remember is that Persona 3 and Persona 4 are very different games, with different plotlines, characters, and stories. They express different things, have different themes, and are player dependent. If you play both games, and believe SEES is a better party than your IT, think for a moment. Did you spend more time level-grinding? Are they better equipped? Do you have a better grasp of the enemy weaknesses than in Persona 4? Is the battle system preferable? Did you emphasize different skills in one than another - and would they be better suited to a different game? It’s not the characters making these things happen - it’s you, and how you play the game, that inevitably influence the outcome.
Wow…nice rant there! Bravo!
Posting stuff and thoughts: whitebellsleuth: little-cyes: OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH! I CAN’T…
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH! I CAN’T ANYMORE! I TRIED KEEPING THIS TO MYSELF! BUT-
Okay, in all seriousness, THIS is the reason I don’t take the nickname ‘partner’ that Yosuke gives Yu/Souji as romantic. I’ve heard the term used so many times, it has…
As a fan who can easily claim Yosuke/protagonist as my OTP, I gotta say I really hate when people say the partner nickname or the hug is part of the subtext. Yosuke calling the protagonist “partner” is something I always thought was really cute, especially with the knowledge on other playthroughs that he wants to be considered equal with our silent hero.
I’ve never understood why people cite the optional hug scene as subtext, either. If my friend broke down into tears, I’m hugging the hell out of him, no matter what other feelings we may or may not have for each other. I get that the protag hugs him around the waist like with the girls he can possibly date, but that’s more a “we have this coding here and don’t want to go and change it for an optional scene” thing than a “let’s add some subtext” thing to me.
To me, all those little scenes, no matter how much we can joke about being 100% HETEROSEXUAL, are awkward and joke-y moments among two close friends. My loving them as a pairing isn’t so much based on subtext as it is my thinking that Yosuke and Yu/Souji/whatever-you-wanna-call-him have a very strong connection that is largely based on Yosuke being able to drop his facade and really be himself, and while in the game (and other adaptions) they’re strictly best friends, I do like exploring the possibility of taking their relationship to another level while trying to stay true to the trust already between them.
Um, this got long. My shipper heart makes explaining things complicated, but yeah, I’m sick of people saying “partner” and other stuff is some sort of sign of possible romance as well. I’m a crazy shipper, sometimes all the subtext I need is “I think they’re adorable, so why the hell not?” Trying to act as if something’s official gets sort of silly after awhile.
Hey, it’s nice to hear from a shipper’s point-of-view too. I thought this was really well written and an interesting point.
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH! I CAN’T ANYMORE! I TRIED KEEPING THIS TO MYSELF! BUT-
Okay, in all seriousness, THIS is the reason I don’t take the nickname ‘partner’ that Yosuke gives Yu/Souji as romantic. I’ve heard the term used so many times, it has become a natural thing for me. I mean, just imagine if ‘partner’ meant something romantic in Toy Story 3, just imagine!
Sorry, I don’t mean to ruin this for any shippers but…yeah. e_e
…People use that as evidence for their romantic shipping? I… wasn’t aware of this.
I had always imagined “patner” to be a friendly term. Perhaps that is merely the child in me remaining oblivious. It seems a rather weak argument or piece of evidence to claim there is romance there.
Honestly, I think it would be a bit awkward and somewhat bizarre if someone who was dating someone else kept calling their romantic interest “partner.” It seems… off in that sense.
Partner just seems to suit the situation better than “bro.”
Some people do use that as part of their evidence, but the most is them being close and touching each other. I think what sparked the pairing even more was the hug. I never saw it like that, it was all just friendly behavior to me.
I can understand why a lot of people ship them though, my OTP is pretty similar to this ship. However, I just can’t ship them for the reasons people give me. Add that to my belief that Yosuke isn’t gay and you’ll have a pretty hard time convincing me.
I think partner was used because of Yosuke’s character. Unlike Junpei, Yosuke has always worked alongside the protagonist, helping him in any way he could. Bro wouldn’t suffice to the relationship they had. Bro is something that he’ll most likely call Kanji or Teddie, not Souji/Yu.
These were the toughest scenes to watch in the entire series. I never thought I could feel sorry for Azula. This is why she’s such a fantastic villain. To be honest I was pretty uninterested in the fight between Aang and Ozai because it was just a badass fight. With Zuko (and Katara) against Azula, you could see her falling apart, and it was incredibly powerful. Also I haven’t been a fan of the music for most of the series but it was so perfect in that scene - sort of sad and giving a sense of inevitability. Azula was too far gone to win this fight.
Dammit I was going to put that so much more eloquently. Oh well.
Azula had the most perfect character development I’ve ever seen in any show ever. True story.
I don’t know if you can call that development. She’s just broke, proving that in the end she was just a frustrated child who blocked her insecurities with violence. It’s more of a deconstruction.
a very tiny thought on the human!ish forms of shadows in persona 4
Interesting perspectives o3o
I always thought that their shadows looked like them because they didn’t manifest into their own world. Unlike the others, Chie and Yosuke weren’t thrown into the TV and they didn’t get their shadow’s personified environment. Then again…Saki and the announcer may not have had that either.